Avril Lavigne

News and Info about Avril Lavigne from a Napanee Area Blogger Girl!

Avril Lavigne Sued! The Rubinoos Lawsuit Sucks!

I saw in the news that some 70s band called the Rubinoos are suing Avril because they think their song "I wanna be your boyfriend" sounds like "Girlfriend"....

[UPDATE: You can read details about the lawsuit settlement at the bottom of my original post by clicking here]

Hmmm... first off, I checked with some of my family who were in their teens in the 70s and they don't remember ever hearing that song before, so I don't know how Avril - who wasn't even born yet - could know it...

And even so - the only similar thing about the song that *I* can hear is that one is about a girlfriend and one is about a boyfriend (Gee, how many songs have been written about THOSE subjects over the past 1000 years, including many many of guys/girls saying they want to be their girlfriend/boyfriend..? LOL) and the fact both have the phrase "Hey! Hey! You! You!"... followed by Avril singing "I don't like your girlfriend" or "I want to be your girlfriend" etc and those Rubes singing "I wanna be your boyfriend"...

You can hear a sample of the Rubes song here on their site (mp3 format) or from Amazon's site. (PC wma format)

So yeah, that is an unusual combination of words ("Hey! Hey! You! You!"), right...?

Wrong!


Back in the mid 1960s a little band you may have heard of called The Rolling Stones sang:
"Hey! Hey! You! You! Get off of my cloud".

See the below video, around 40 seconds in... oh, and the girls screaming and singing along in the audience are the same age as my grandmother now! LOL



And in the 1980s..?

A singer called Billy Ocean had a huge hit with "Get Outta My Dreams, Get Into My Car" that starts with the words: "Hey! Hey! You! You! Get into my car"



Want more?

Here's a great song by another Canadian singer Fefe Dobson singing "Get You Off".

Check out this live video where she sings early in the song: "Hey! Hey! You! You! Get off of my back".



Want more...? *sigh* :)

Here's a singer called Soluna who has a song with the name "Hey Hey You You" (followed by "I figure it's true true" etc.)

Couldn't find a video, but here's an audio sample from Amazon's site. (PC wma format)


So yeah, in my opinion there are a TON of songs about boyfriends and girlfriends in the whole history of songs. And there are also FAR more popular songs that used the phrase "Hey Hey You You" than the Rubinoos.

PLUS... the only "hit" the Rubinoos ever had was a REMAKE of an old 1967 song by Tommy James and the Shondells called "I Think We're Alone Now"... which was remade again in the 1980s by a singer called "Tiffany".

Hey! Maybe the Rolling Stones should sue the Rubinoos for stealing that phrase from their "Get off of my cloud" song, since that song came out more than ten years before their 'Boyfriend" song did! :)


UPDATE: Avril wrote a post on her own website about the Rubinoos lawsuit and also about Chantal Kreviazuk being quoted as saying Avril stole a song she sent her years ago called 'Contagious' (which isn't true either) .

BTW, Av also mentions one of the songs I show above as having the same type of lyrics as 'Boyfriend' or 'Girlfriend' - 'Get off of my cloud' by the Rolling Stones.

The other song she thought of is "I wanna be your boyfriend' by the Ramones, which was released on their 1978 album.... three years before the Rubinoos' song with the same name!

Just so people know what that song sounds like, I added a video of them singing that song live in Paris in 1980 (according to what it says on that Youtube video).



Read Avril's post "To my Dear Media, Friends, and Fans" by clicking here!


Hilarious Update!

Check out this funny video by theroachyjay over on YouTube called "No One Knows What The Rubinoos Are Saying Anyway!!" :)



UPDATE:
I just saw this new quote by Terry McBride (Avril's manager) about the lawsuit from Access Hollywood's website (and via 'abcmystery' on Avril's discussion forum)

Dear Media,

I have read the following quote from Tommy Dunbar of the Rubinoos.

"While it's true that we filed suit some time ago, we hesitated to go public to save Avril and her handlers any embarrassment," Tommy Dunbar said. "We learned over the July 4th holiday that her management and spin doctors have apparently decided to preempt things with their revelation of the lawsuit."

This is simply a lie. I challenge them to provide one iota of proof to back up this claim. We did not say a word about the suit out of respect for the dialog that was ongoing. The numerous phone calls from the media seeking comment on the suit started on July 4th. We were blind sided and simply responded.

We also find it ironic that in the Suit they named Apple as a defendant, what a great way of getting it out there to the media.

On the topic of Apple, it seems like the Rubinoos have an issue with the Beatles among other great bands. This quote is directly from the Rubinoos Myspace page "Bands that have ripped us blind: the Raspberries, The Beach Boys, The Beatles"

As we have clearly stated, upon the expert opinion of one of the country's foremost musicologists, there is no basis for this claim."

UPDATE - July 18 - New info about the Rubinoos 'Girlfriend' lawsuit...

The L.A. Times reported new quotes from both sides of the Rubinoos lawsuit...
..speaking publicly on the matter for the first time, "Girlfriend's" co-writer Lukasz "Dr. Luke" Gottwald has lashed out at the plaintiffs — songwriters James Gangwer and original Rubinoos member Tommy Dunbar — denying allegations that he and Lavigne "copied" "Boyfriend."

"I never heard of the Rubinoos before the lawsuit," said Gottwald, an in-demand producer who has crafted hits for Kelly Clarkson, Pink and Daughtry, among others. "I never heard of the song and neither has Avril. I would take a polygraph on that in front of them."

"Me and Avril wrote the song together," Gottwald told The Times. "It started out with Avril wanting to make something fun and upbeat. It has the same chord progressions as 10 different Blink-182 songs, the standard changes you'd find in a Sum 41 song. It's the Sex Pistols, not the Rubinoos."

The lead singer of the Rubinoos, Jon Rubin (who is not a part of the lawsuit because he didn't write it), told The Times that in terms of meter and chord progression, "Girlfriend" bears a close resemblance to "I Wanna Be Your Boyfriend." He also thinks that "Girlfriend" has more similarities to a 1997 cover version of the song, retitled "I Wanna Be Your Girlfriend" by the female-fronted Brit-pop band Lush.

Rubin said: "We got tons of e-mails about it. 'You guys must be collecting big dough now.' Well, actually not."

UPDATE - July 18 - Avril Thanks her fans!

Thank you, from Avril.
Hey everyone.

I wanted to take this time to thank you, my fans for all your undying support. You have been amazing and i can't express how much i appreciate it. Thank you all so much. I am so proud of this record and grateful for the response it has been getting from all of my fans. You made it go 1!!

also,

there is another great record i've been listening to lately. And i want you all to hear it too. The new SUM41 album called Underclass Hero comes out in 1 week on july 24. You can hear the whole album now for free here:

http://www.mtv.com/music/the_leak/sum_41/underclass_hero/

my favorite songs are "With Me", "Walking Disaster", "Best of me" "Confusion and Frustration"

It rocks you have to check it out. And of course you can also check out myspace.com/sum41 for more info.

Thank you all again, you mean so much to me.

Avril Lavigne,
...


UPDATE: January 2008 - According to WTOP News....

SAN FRANCISCO - A settlement has been reached in the battle over a popular song.

"Girlfriend" by Avril Lavigne was a big hit in 2007, and a song that sounds like you may have heard it before. A 1970s pop band called the Rubinoos says it sounds a lot like one of their songs, "I Wanna Be Your Boyfriend."

The bands' songwriters sued Lavigne and others involved with the song, claiming copyright infringement.

In a Dec. 14 order, U.S. District Court for the Northern District of California Judge Charles Breyer entered an Order of Dismissal, saying he was been notified by the parties that "they have agreed to a settlement of this case."

Neither side will say what's in the settlement as far as payment, or if a conclusion was reached of whether the song was ripped off.

source

--------------

January 15, 2008...

The Rubinoos' Tommy Dunbar and James Gangwer released the following statement:

"We are satisfied that any similarities between the two songs resulted from Avril and Luke's use of certain common and widely used lyrics.

We therefore completely exonerate Avril and Luke from any wrongdoing of any kind in connection with the claims made by us in our lawsuit.
"

So... pretty much what most people expected. They settled out of court for an undisclosed amount of money instead of spending (likely just as much if not more) for the cost of a trial.

:(

Original Post written: Friday, July 06, 2007

Friday, July 06, 2007 3:03:00 PM

Wow... nice researching...    



Friday, July 06, 2007 3:15:00 PM

sounds like someone from the 70's didn't make any money with their crappy songs so the'll go after anyone who has a song that has a few words in common,GET OVER IT BOYS YOU STILL SUCK    



Friday, July 06, 2007 4:10:00 PM

Very impressive bit of researching indeed.

And thanks for the news update on my blog.

I still think the melodic idea combined with lyrical content of the lines in question make the songs too similar - regardless of how many other people used the "hey-hey-you-you" combination in their own songs.    



Friday, July 06, 2007 4:10:00 PM

Thanks Andre for complimenting my research! :)

When someone accuses Avril for something she didn't do, we Napanee (and Napanee Area) girls gotta stick together! LOL

-----

And to the other commenter, I certainly agree there are only a few common words together between the two songs (and about 30 years!).

Maybe that group had some lawyers pushing them into it... because something else I read about this lawsuit, but forgot to mention in my post, is that Avril may *have* to settle out of court - pay them money, even though she knows she is innocent!

Why? Because Avril's lawyers are expensive and she and the record company will have to pay 100s of thousands of dollars for lawyers to fight this in court (I saw $500,000 mentioned as possible!)...

But the Rubinoos lawyers will do it for a commission - getting paid only if the Rubes win.

But if Avril wins she and the record company will be out up to a half million dollars, and if they sue the Rubinoo guys to get that money back.. they will probably declare bankruptcy, and Avril will be out all that money anyways!

...or they can give the Rubes "only" $100,000 to go away, and save up to $400,000 that they would have spent in court. :(

I hope they don't settle, but it isn't my money being spent. :)

---

Thanks for commenting guys!

- Courtney    



Friday, July 06, 2007 4:16:00 PM

Thank you Keith for coming here to comment on my blog too! :)

We have different opinions but that's okay. I just find it difficult to believe Avril or whoever she may have cowrote that song with had ever even heard that 1970s song.

And even if they did, it wouldn't make any sense to steal anything from it since there are *always* lawsuits in the music industry any time someone thinks a new song has similar lyrics or music to their old one.

But that's just my opinion... which just happens to be right. ;)

Thanks,

- Courtney    



Friday, July 06, 2007 8:57:00 PM

just because that rubinoos song is from the 70's doesn't mean she can't know about it. For example, how about a bunch of the BeeGees' songs? I wasn't born in their time but I still hear plenty of their songs. :P    



Saturday, July 07, 2007 12:44:00 AM

oh yeah, I agree. The Beatles, Elvis Presley, etc. I've heard lots of songs by singers or groups that were popular years before I was born.

But if you went out on the street of any big city one week ago, or even today, and asked 100 people on the street if they'd ever heard of the Rubinoos before... or even played that Boyfriend song and asked if they'd heard it before, I'd bet not even 2 people would day yes.

And almost definitely all 100 would say they'd never heard of them before, even if they actually WERE alive in the 1970s and did hear that song on the radio back then.

So I get what you mean by saying you've heard of the Bee Gees , even though you weren't born in their time.

But The Rubinoos were NOT the Bee Gees, even back in the 1970s. :)

Thanks for commenting though!

- Courtney    



Saturday, July 07, 2007 3:16:00 AM

Hi Bloggergirl! Its The Roachy Jay from Youtube. Thanks for posting my video! =)

I have another one if you're interested in seeing it; I made it a few hours before I made that one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0R7xHbWyzA

It was my immediate satirical response to the entire situation.

-Michelle; The Roachy Jay
http://www.theroachyjay.tk/    



Saturday, July 07, 2007 3:49:00 AM

Not being an Avril Lavigne or Rubinoos fan, I have no stake in this subject.

However, as an entertainment writer and guitar player myself, I would simply like to point out a few things.

Let's get the obvious out of the way: rock 'n' roll is built on pyramids of borrowing and plagarism. Not every case (real or imagined) is pursued, for various reasons (notably, legal fees).

That said, the courts have not taken kindly to the more blatant examples in rock 'n 'roll history.

The best one is the 1970 case involving "My Sweet Lord" (George Harrison): a federal court ruled the chorus had too much in common (musically) with The Chiffons' hit, "He's So Fine."

Harrison argued that he hadn't intended that to happen: the court didn't see it that way, and ordered the ex-Beatle to pay a cool $587K to the girl group's publishers.

So, if an "unintentional" lift can't be defended, this situation -- in which folks are having a field day playing the two songs back to back -- will be an even steeper climb for Avril and company (in theory).

Music plagarism suits are typically decided on two factors: to what extent are the melodies "close enough to be dangerous," as they say? (Lyrical content is also weighed, but that's a separate issue.)

Even parodies have run into problemas, as in Two Live Crew's revamping of Roy Orbison's "Pretty Woman" -- which used the famous opening lick that we've all heard a million times.

The other key issue turns on access: to what extent did the defendant have a chance to hear the song in dispute?

Well, the Rubinoos have a myspace site, and I also recall a boxed set that came out recently on Rhino Entertainment (not a mom-and-pop indie).

The Rubinoos' music has been continually reissued on CD by other labels, as well. They had one hit (a cover of Tommy James' "I Think We're ALone Now," in 1977), so this is not an obscure basement rock band, by any means.

But the Rubinoos' fame (or lack thereof) will not be a relevant issue in the courtroom, only how Avril and co-writers could have heard the song, and how much of it ended up with their names on it. That's it, plain and simple.

A settlement would likely be wise, not because of the money -- depending on Avril's contract, her label would either claw it back from royalties, or write it off against their insurance -- but because the PR fallout has already been so big, and that wouldn't be to her advantange.

One last point...

I know friends who've had whole chunks of their own writing lifted, and stuck on other sites, without a credit, or even a thanks -- so, although it's been said that "imitation is the sincerest form of flattery," not everybody looks at it at that way, and this lawsuit is only the latest example.

So goes life in the rock 'n' roll technocracy.    



Saturday, July 07, 2007 12:40:00 PM

Hey Michelle (Roachy Jay)!

Yes I did see your other video after I already posted this one of yours here. I liked it a lot too! :)

---

And to the 'anonymous' poster afterwards: thanks for your detailed comments!

Obviously you can see by this blog post that I personally don't think the songs are close enough for the Rubinoos to win a lawsuit, or even to sue her in the first place.

There are other songs with similar beats and words and even with the exact same title as their own song.

But the court system is far from perfect and anyone can sue anyone for anything these days.

So maybe the courts WILL decide her song is too close to theirs, even if it was by complete coincidence. Or Avril will be forced to settle out of court just to get this over with and to actually save more money than if she went to court and won.

But I honestly don't think the songs are similar enough at all.

I guess we'll have to wait and see what happens. :)

Thanks for the comments!

- Courtney    



Saturday, July 07, 2007 1:33:00 PM

Courtney,

Mr. Anonymous here...and I'm happily stepping out from behind the curtain!

I respect your opinion, I just thought a little bit of historical context was in order.

A lot of these cases seem to be instigated by music publishers, who guard their interests keenly (as Mick Jones, of Big Audio Dynamite, learned in 1986, when he got sued for lifting a melody line from Eddie Cochran's own "C'mon Everybody" for the song, "C'mon Every Beatbox" -- that case was also settled, I believe).

I forgot to mention the most unusual suit, filed in 1985 against former Creedence Clearwater Revival singer-guitarist John Fogerty.

Fogerty's former record label, Fantasy Records, sued him, alleging that he'd plagarized himself for his solo hit ("The Old Man Down The Road").

This meant that Fogerty had to get up in court, with a guitar, and show the jury how he wrote all those CCR hits!

However, the PR fallout was so negative that both sides ended up settling all their differences before the proceedings concluded. (Remember, Fogerty didn't play those songs for so long, citing "inconsistencies" in how Fantasy paid royalties to him.)

I also forgot one other notable case, involving Oasis, who had to take "Step Out" off their CD, WHAT'S THE STORY (MORNING GLORY) (1995), after Stevie Wonder's publishers felt the song sounded a bit too similar to the harmonica man's '60s classic, "Uptight."

You can still find this song as an out-of-print CD single...and, funnily enough, the choruses do sound pretty similar.

Also, on that same CD, Oasis had to co-credit Gary Glitter, for using a snippet of his '70s hit, "Hello, Hello (I'm Back Again)" on the opening track, "Hello."

The moral of all these stories? Plagarism seems to be in the eye of the beholder (as Mick Jones pointed out, in his own defense, Eddie Cochran's song was based largely on "Rockin' Pneumonia And The Boogie Woogie Flu"). We'll just have to see what happens, I guess.    



Saturday, July 07, 2007 11:24:00 PM

you blog is right. avril lavigne's 'Girlfriend' sounds NOTHING like the roobinos or whatever. Nice reasearching, like 'andre' said    



Sunday, July 08, 2007 4:45:00 PM

Thanks again Chairman Ralph for delurking and showing more examples of how lawsuits in the music industry happen all the time - with some being successful and others not.

As I have been seeing from reading a lot of press and blog posts etc, people are on both sides of this lawsuit. Some agree, some don't.

---

p.s. I have to laugh (sort of) at the online newspapers that have "reported" this story.

I have posted comments on many blogs - including many with high 'authority' ranks - and all or almost all have shown my comments on their blog, even if they had a different opinion.

But my posts were NOT included on at least couple of 'newspaper' websites I commented at to let people know I had done some research on my own blog (here) about the lawsuit.

It seems like most newspapers these days just state whatever they hear first without actually doing any investigation of their own first, to see if a claim or lawsuit is true.

And it seems they get upset when a regular person like me does the work they SHOULD be doing before they print a story as fact and not really adding anything new of their own.

And I'm talking about the Globe and Mail's article "Has Avril lost her song cred" and a Wall Street Journal law blog post which *initially* did not print my comment, but a second comment by me (a few minutes ago on July 8) *seems* to be staying so far.

I'll see if THAT one stays on their site this time. LOL :)

- Courtney    



Tuesday, July 10, 2007 12:27:00 AM

It would be nice, considering all the work youve done. if you were actually to look atthe evidnce youve collected and make an intelligent conclusion base don the facts, not on your fawning over a pop star. Im sure michael jacksons fans belive he did nothing wrong either. The rolling stones ( of whom you have no right to even discuss since i havent seen a post yet from one person who was alive during thier initial success and dominance, song get offa my cloud, sounds nothing like either avril's song nor the accusers song. simply putting out songs that have hey you in them is not at all what he lawsuit is about. its about words AND music. as in the rythm, the notes, the keys and the beats are the same for both songs. could it be a coincidence? sure it could. but to simply say any song with hey you in it makes avril's song original, is the height of stupidity. I applaud your work ethic, but not your , tiger beat , reaction.    



Tuesday, July 10, 2007 8:34:00 PM

Wow, looks like the mud is flying thick and fast: ready, aim, splat!

Let's see what happens when the pros and cons are laid out in the courtroom, before we conclude that one person is the Devil incarnate, while the other is the angel of light.

As a former cop and court writer, I can safely say this...just when you think it's a slam dunk, that's when it gets real complicated (no pun intended).    



Wednesday, July 11, 2007 10:30:00 AM

Thanks Chairman Ralph for popping
by again! I can see now (that you've mentioned a couple of your past jobs) where you get your knowledgeable insights from. :)

---

And to (*sigh*) 'anonymous'...

> "It would be nice, considering all the work youve done. if you were actually to look atthe evidnce youve collected and make an intelligent conclusion base don the facts, not on your fawning over a pop star."<

I actually did look at the evidence, and it just confirmed what my initial reaction was to the lawsuit: Avril's innocent.

If you look around Youtube , blogs, and other commentary, you'll see MANY people with the same opinion I have. And others who have the same opinion as you too.


>"Im sure michael jacksons fans belive he did nothing wrong either."<

You're correct there - I saw some crowd reactions just as the (last) verdict was read, and many were very happy about him being found not guilty.

But neither I nor you (I assume. lol) know whether he is actually guilty or not... and you seem to imply, without knowing 100%, that he IS.


>"The rolling stones ( of whom you have no right to even discuss since i havent seen a post yet from one person who was alive during thier initial success and dominance, song get offa my cloud, sounds nothing like either avril's song nor the accusers song.<

LOL. I can discuss anyone or anything I want on my own website.. or any other website too, for that matter.

And how do you know how old the commenters here or elsewhere are? Some may be in their 40s or older.

And does that mean we can't discuss Napoleon either, because none of us were alive during his 'initial success and dominance'?

At least the Rolling Stones are alive (not sure about Keith Richards, though. lol) *and* still drawing huge audiences.

Plus, after first writing my post here, Avril also mentioned that song ("Get off of my cloud") in her official comments about the lawsuit as have many others on Youtube and in other websites I've seen.

I just happen to have been one of the first. :)


> simply putting out songs that have hey you in them is not at all what he lawsuit is about. its about words AND music.<

..so in the first sentence you say the songs' words are 'not at ALL what the lawsuit is about' (my emphasis), and then in the next sentence you say 'it's about words AND music'.

So which is it?

In fact, since the lyrics (for that ONE line) are similar, it's one of the points being discussed the most from what I've seen.

Check out this video to see someone else making the same comparison: "The Rubinoos rip off The Rolling Stones"...


>"...as in the rythm, the notes, the keys and the beats are the same for both songs."<

They are?

The musicologist (or whatever they're called) hired by Avril's people said the exact opposite.

And I'd imagine he will/could be used as an expert witness in court.

Could you be..?


>"could it be a coincidence? sure it could."<

Thank you for supporting Avril! ;)

LOL. Well, at least you're giving her the benefit of the doubt.

And if it *is* just a coincidence, why sue her? People do things inadvertently all the time, and the fact there are SOME similarities doesn't necessarily mean the Rubes have to go to court over it.

...Otherwise the Rubinoos could have been taken to court in 1979 by the Rolling Stones for the 'hey hey you you' part of their song, or by the Ramones who has a song with the exact same title a few years earlier.


>"but to simply say any song with hey you in it makes avril's song original, is the height of stupidity."<

'Girlfriend' is as original as any other song out there.

Consider how many songs have been written over the years and you can bet there are MANY songs with very similar or identical beats or rhythms and lyrics etc too.

And if you think my opinion (and many others) is the 'height of stupidity' then you have a very limited imagination. ;)


>"I applaud your work ethic, but not your , tiger beat , reaction."<

Thanks... I think. lol

'Tiger Beat' refers to the magazine by the same name, I assume.

But you and other critics should keep in mind that this is a blog. And blogs very (most?) often are a place for people to write their opinions about something - just like newspaper columnists do.

They don't simply report the news, they offer their opinion about it.

So I don't have to be 'fair and balanced' (and neither is Fox News, even though that's their line).

I just have to have an opinion and, if I want to be taken even half ways serious, show some proof or reasoning for why I think what I think. :)

But either way, thanks for commenting!

- Courtney    



Wednesday, July 11, 2007 10:40:00 AM

Courtney, your "research" is more editorial and moronic than anything, ranting and defending a no talent wanna-be-although-successfully-marketed delusional little girl.

If you had any type of brain your "that was in the 70s" argument wouldn't have even entered into play.

I am a singer songwriter and though i may never become famous, and yes I am ok with that, I protect my original work so if someone does actually hear my songs they cannot “accidentally” rip it off in the future without me being able to sue, even thirty years from now!

I don't waste time responding to blogs unless I feel strongly compelled to do so, as I felt in this case. But your sheer gall at insinuating that a news agency should have mentioned your blog when reporting a story just made me flip. Really? Who the fuck do you think you are? Clearly you are as delusional as your pop idol is.

Go marry a rich man and shut the hell up    



Wednesday, July 11, 2007 7:42:00 PM

Hello

This is for anyone caught up in this mishap.. These acustations against my girl Avril arn't true. There 2 different songs. For these 2 goonies two get a settlement in California is unfair and bullshit. They don't deserve a penny. I know she is innocent and I can prove it, The reason how I know this is let me tell you a little story. When I was little my mon used to say " I need to talk to my girlfriend" She meant her friends, I told Avril "I LOVE YOU" I do the rumors are true and I called her my "GIrlfriend" I had fun with this ,She is a very close friend of mine and I have known her for years, you could say I am part of the crew. Then while the band wawas working on the album they decieded to write Girlfriend, The song is about me and Im the guy who she is singing about. At first I didn't understand but yesterday for the first time I actually read the lyrics and I understand the song, then it came to me she was thinking about me when she was writting this song, and I love her even more know I sware I got up off my chair and wanted to go see her right away, I miss her anyway, I guess I mentioned it a little to much maybe. Im the only guy out there besides the band the understands this song probobly. This song really means something to me because it proved to me that she cared, and she love's me, because if Avril didn't care they wouldn't have written this song in there album, and for them to come in and put a lawsuit against her for copyright broke my heart because these accusations are BULLSHIT..... That's the Truth

I don't think this trial will go that far my friends layers look like they have it taken care of but if they need my help in Oakland in Augest I'll be there


LOVE Always and forever

STEVE
ferencjames@yahoo.ca

I am still waiting for her    



Wednesday, July 11, 2007 11:30:00 PM

In response to the very last comment above this one...

That was awesome! LOL

And thanks for commenting.

-----------

And to DuneLeader:

>Courtney, your "research" is more editorial and moronic than anything<

Exactly my point... except the 'moronic' part. ha

My blog and this post *is* editorial. I heard this news, had an opinion about it, and wrote how I felt in my Avril Lavigne themed blog.


>ranting and defending a no talent wanna-be-although-successfully-marketed delusional little girl.<

'Ranting' may be too strong of a word. I wasn't jumping up and down and frothing at the mouth about either the lawsuit or any comments posted here that criticized my opinion (not mentioning any names).

And Avril is a "no talent"? You're right that there are quite a few performers and groups who aren't THAT talented, and are more a product of studio trickery and marketing, but imo Avril *does* have talent.

Take for instance her appearance on Mad TV just a short time after the Ashlee Simpson SNL lip synching controversy (if I remember correctly).

Avril sat on stage and sang alone with no instruments aside from her own guitar.

And while I realize her songs or genre may not be your cup of tea, just like I don't like all types of music (but can recognize a good voice when I hear it), take a look at this video of that performance with an open mind and I'm sure you'll agree she DOES have talent...

http://youtube.com/watch?v=N94ivJTM2vg


>If you had any type of brain your "that was in the 70s" argument wouldn't have even entered into play.<

The reason I mentioned that is because the Rubinoos song is obscure and came out years before Avril was even born.


>I am a singer songwriter and though i may never become famous, and yes I am ok with that, I protect my original work so if someone does actually hear my songs they cannot “accidentally” rip it off in the future without me being able to sue, even thirty years from now!<

Well, good luck with that.


>I don't waste time responding to blogs unless I feel strongly compelled to do so, as I felt in this case.<

Then I've achieved one of my goals. :)

Having a strong opinion about something is *suppose* to inspire counter arguments and discussion.

And, especially after reading many comments elsewhere equally supporting Avril, I don't exactly feel like I'm in the minority with my opinion.

I've seen many posts by people who admitted not liking Avril or her music but agree the Rubinoos song sounds virtually nothing like 'Girlfriend'.


> But your sheer gall at insinuating that a news agency should have mentioned your blog when reporting a story just made me flip.<

Then it seems you flip easier than a circus dog!

I didn't say news agencies should mention my blog when reporting this story, I said: ..."my posts were NOT included on at least couple of 'newspaper' websites I *commented* at".

I was simply mentioning that any comments I made to an individual's website or blog always showed up, even the ones that are moderated.

But for the couple of genuine news websites that allow commenting on their Avril lawsuit stories, some showed tons of comments but failed to show mine.

But in fact I was galled not so much about that, but moreso because of what I hate about mainstream media in general...

Specifically, they don't actually write their own articles anymore - or at least FAR fewer than they feature. Most 'articles' are simply cut and pasted from Reuters or the Associated Press, etc.

I have read a LOT of mainstream media articles about this lawsuit, and the vast majority are exactly the same. They don't even bother taking the time to reword them.

And of the few that ARE unique... they don't really add anything to new - probably just rewrite what came from Reuters into their own words (although there are a FEW who posted something unique and with substance).

..and actually I can update what I said before - while the Globe & Mail still doesn't have my comment on there, the first comment I posted on the Wall Street Journal Law blog *has* since appeared (after my second comment showed up).


>Really? Who the fuck do you think you are? Clearly you are as delusional as your pop idol is.<

Language! For a wordsmith (or songsmith) you should have a substantial enough vocabulary to get your point across without swearing.

However it is nice to see my writing can invoke such strong passions in some people. LOL

And as for who I think I am... I'm quite happy, actually.

Especially when I recently realized that searching for Avril Lavigne blog on Yahoo shows my website at #1 out of 18,000,000 other websites, including Avril's own Myspace page. :)


>Go marry a rich man and shut the hell up<

*gasp* That sounds quite sexist!

Perhaps jealousy over Avril's success vs. your own is rearing its ugly head.

But don't be too angry. Maybe you can comfort yourself with the fact there are many many MALE singer songwriters having more success than you too - it's not JUST the girls. ;)

And thanks for commenting!

- Courtney    



Thursday, July 12, 2007 12:35:00 AM

Actually, when I read that little nugget ("go marry a rich man, and shut the hell up"), I had images of Fred Flintstone bawling out his eternally patient wife: "Wilma, in my cave, I reign supreme! SU-PREME!"

Somehow, though, I reckon that other women who read such comments won't be as perennially forgiving as Wilma (especially when it comes to asking, "Will you buy my CD?". Enough said.    



Friday, July 13, 2007 11:22:00 AM

what's it like being a fan of a big poser, who doesn't actually write her own songs. But is merely present when they are working on them?    



Friday, July 13, 2007 3:34:00 PM

I'm not sure what that would be like, since I'm not a fan of any performer who does that.

But thanks for commenting! :)

- Courtney    



Friday, July 13, 2007 4:48:00 PM

yes you are a fan of that type of, ahem "artist".
namely, avril lavigne.    



Friday, July 13, 2007 5:08:00 PM

So there's an artist named 'Avril Lavigne" too?!

I guess that's sorta like how there's an ice skater named 'Sasha Cohen' and also an actor who plays Borat named 'Sasha Cohen' too...?

Wow, I didn't know that! *snicker*

- Courtney    



Saturday, July 14, 2007 1:01:00 AM

OH MY GOSH AVRIL LAVIGNE IS SO SO SO SO SO SO NOT GELTY :( WHAT WERE THE RIBOONS THINKING OF... THEY ARE SO RETARDS ALOT OF PPL STOLE THE HEY HEY YOU YOU AND THEY DID NOT GET SUED WHAT IS ^ WITH THAT :| SO I HAVE ALITTLE SONG FOR YOU RIBBONS SORREY I SPELT THE NAME RONG NOT NOT NOT LOL THAT WAS SO SO FUNNNY FUNNY SORRY I LIKE REPET ALOT LOL LOL LOL



HEY HEY YOU YOU THE RIBBONS ARE RETARDS

NO WAY NO WAY THERE SHOULDIN'T BE A LAWSUIT


HEY HEY YOU YOU THE RIBOONS NEED TO GET A LIFE :) :) :) NOW I FILL SO MUCH BETTER DO YOU I THINK THAT IS A NO NO NO NO NO NO NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! BYE RIBOONE RETARDS HOPE YOU LOSE THE LAWSUIT BYE BYE BYE BYE BYE BYE    



Saturday, July 14, 2007 1:31:00 AM

omg avrile liviane should not be gelty ::::::(((((((( :|
she is so pretty and she is talented and we dont need her talent to go to wast so tell all your friends to vote for avrile so roombers dont win i mad up a little song it goes like this hey hey you you robmers are a retared no way no way there should'nt be a lawsuit hey hey you you the roombers are a reatared's how do we want avril how do we not want roombers!!! hope they dont sue me for that song lol jk    



Saturday, July 14, 2007 1:33:00 AM

I still think the melodic idea combined with lyrical content of the lines in question make the songs too similar - regardless of how many other people used the "hey-hey-you-you" combination in their own songs.    



Saturday, July 14, 2007 1:35:00 AM

sounds like someone from the 70's didn't make any money with their crappy songs so the'll go after anyone who has a song that has a few words in common,GET OVER IT BOYS YOU STILL SUCK    



Saturday, July 14, 2007 1:36:00 AM

And to the other commenter, I certainly agree there are only a few common words together between the two songs (and about 30 years!).

Maybe that group had some lawyers pushing them into it... because something else I read about this lawsuit, but forgot to mention in my post, is that Avril may *have* to settle out of court - pay them money, even though she knows she is innocent!

Why? Because Avril's lawyers are expensive and she and the record company will have to pay 100s of thousands of dollars for lawyers to fight this in court (I saw $500,000 mentioned as possible!)...    



Saturday, July 14, 2007 1:49:00 PM

Courtney,

Good Job. I don't know why Avril would settle or defend herself when she could have these guys whacked for a mere 50 grand. And, I'll do their lawyers for free. I mean, I know a guy.

Uncle Bob    



Saturday, July 14, 2007 9:33:00 PM

Courtney!

Your last update is HILARIOUS! The Rubinoos claim the Beatles and the beach boys ripped off them! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!! I'm going to laugh for hours. It sounds JUST like the personality voice I gave them in my video "Avril Lavigne vs The Rubinoos: The Untold Story"

-The Roachy Jay
http://roachyrpg.proboards50.com/    



Monday, July 30, 2007 11:47:00 AM

What about the song I'm the kinda by Peaches.

Listen to it and again it sounds just like I dont have to try by Avril.

Has she never heard of them either??    



Tuesday, July 31, 2007 2:04:00 PM

Re: the Peaches song...

Yes, I heard about the latest comments online about a part of Peaches' song sounding similar to a part of Avril's song.

>Has she never heard of them either??

Ha - well first off Peaches is a "she" not a "them"...

And secondly, Avril has listed that Peaches song as one of her favs in published interviews - including the July issue of InSyle magazine - so obviously she is not trying to hide anything.

That's like telling every one how much you like your neighbour's car and then stealing the car and parking it in your driveway. :) Avril isn't that stupid.

And I've read critiques from musicians about the songs' similarity and they said there are significant differences in the beat. But either way, Avril simply liked the way the Peaches song sounded and wanted to have a similar sound for one of her songs.

Peaches hasn't sued Avril or said anything about it, so if she doesn't care why should anyone else?

The people criticizing Avril are just jumping on the bandwagon to take shots at Avril because she's rich, beautiful and talented... and they aren't. :)

Thanks for the question though. It's good to have a chance to clear this (latest) BS rumour straight. :)

~ Courtney    



Saturday, August 11, 2007 9:33:00 AM

Avril doesnt write her own music a mid 50's guy does who problibly did hear the song, in responce to your thought that avril wasnt born when that song was written.

-Real musicians write their own music    



Tuesday, August 14, 2007 9:13:00 AM

Hi... 'anonymous'.

>"Avril doesnt write her own music<

Really? Unless you follow her around everyday, and into the studio, you couldn't possibly know that.

And of course I, and everyone who's actually written songs with her, would disagree with you.

> "a mid 50's guy does"

a 'mid 50's guy'? What's his name?

So you're saying all of Avril's songs were written by a guy in is mid-50's? That's hilarious.

>"who problibly did hear the song,"

It's 'probably'.

And 'probably' sounds like you're making a guess. And a bad one at that.


>"in responce to your thought that avril wasnt born when that song was written."<

It's "response" and "wasn't".


>"Real musicians write their own music"<

Really?

So you're saying a concert pianist (let's say someone who's played Carnegie Hall and in front of Kings and Presidents) isn't a "real musician" simply because he/she plays classic Beethoven & Bach without actually writing any music themselves?

Wow.

But even if that were true, I've read from virtually all Avril's collaborators who have clearly stated she is involved in and cowrote most/all of her songs with them.

But many times their words are taken out of context to make it sound like they had said she doesn't actually write, and then have to correct what was written by others to get the truth out.

ie. 'The Matrix' recently cleared up the fact people were saying Avril didn't contribute to the songs they were involved with for her. They clearly stated she was *very* involved.

Also, as far as writing goes, I just checked a page at MTV.com which stated: "...along with producer Matthew Gerrard, (Avril) Lavigne wrote (Kelly) Clarkson's single, "Breakaway".

So she writes for others but doesn't write for herself..? Doubtful.

But thanks for playing! :)

~ Courtney    



Wednesday, May 07, 2008 8:22:00 PM

Let me first state that I like both The Rubinoos and Avril Lavigne. When I first heard Avril's "Girlfriend" I immediately thought both of The Rubinoos "I Wanna Be Your Boyfriend" and Toni Basil's "Mickey". My spouse had the impression that it was an homage to The Rubinoos as well. Friends of mine are very aware of both songs and their similarities.

This comment is being posted long after the case has been settled out of court so "the why" or "how" the songs sound familiar is no longer an issue.

It may be a generalization to state that nobody has ever heard of The Rubinoos and that they did not have the right to sue. Every songwriter or publisher has the right to their day in court if a song in question has been lifted and The Rubinoos have had success and have stayed busy recording and performing since the seventies. As mentioned earlier, their albums have been re-released a number of times in this digital age and have influenced a large number of artists in the last thirty years. You don't have to be a household name or splashed upon the cover of People Magazine or Spin and Rolling Stone to be an influence on other artists.

With over twenty compliation albums and a recent box set in the discography...the band is clearly not an unknown group to the music industry. "I Wanna Be Your Boyfriend" has even been used in film soundtracks. Can't recall if it was Spike Lee's "Summer Of Sam" that was on television recently that used the song in the background or another contemporary film. Regardless...the band does have credibility. Heck...the song still gets airplay on the radio (terrestial AM/FM, satellite and internet). Yes it doesn't get nearly the amount of airplay that Led Zeppelin's "Stairway To Heaven" or Whitney Houston's version of Dolly Parton's "I Will Always Love You" gets. It most likely barely gets a fraction of one percent of airplay of other late seventies to early eighties songs on the radio but it still does and that says something again about credibility.

Avril Lavigne is powerhouse artist with a major record label ready and willing to spend a fortune in promoting their artist. Avril is a major talent. There is no doubt in my mind that she has songwriting chops and can play musical instruments. I saw her in concert during the tour for her second album with American Hi-Fi as her band (and her producer Butch Walker as opening act). She not only sang extremely well live but also performed on the guitar, piano and drums!

I have all of her albums as I do The Rubinoos. Since there appeared to be an inordinate amount of just Avril supporters on this blog, I thought that I would bring you a different perspective. It may be a generational difference but being in my late twenties and surrounded by mostly folks in their thirties and forties may be the reason that most of them have heard of The Rubinoos and feel that Avril's song "Girlfriend" does sound like "I Wanna Be Your Boyfriend". It doesn't necessarily make it a criminal civil act that requires court time. It doesn't mean that the song was intentionally stolen. While most of the comments on this blog don't hear the song sounding the same...trust me when I say that there are others who do think the songs sound very much alike. Personally I don't think Avril lifted the song. Somewhere along the line, either in arrangement or production, the song began to sound a bit like the older song. Seeing her perform on both "Saturday Night Live" and "David Letterman" in the same week still made me think how much the songs sounded alike. In the end it didn't really matter to me because I liked the song. I like both songs.

I'm here posting this comment because I do appreciate the music of both acts and think that both are respectable artists. I cannot speculate on exactly how "Girlfriend" came to be what it was when it was finally mastered or who was involved in every last detail. It doesn't matter if someone in Avril's circle was familiar with the song or never heard it before. Rock and pop music has always had songs that sound alike. Just listen to Top 40 now, both rock or hip-hop have competing songs on the charts that have similar sounds...this has been the case since the fifties when rock and roll exploded onto the scene.    



Wednesday, July 23, 2008 11:28:00 AM

listen to this one, i heard on french radio FIP today:
Laetitia Frenod - Pop Generation (2006)
you can find it here:
http://blaxxmusic.free.fr/musiques.htm or directly there http://blaxxmusic.free.fr/popgeneration.m3u
it's a small sound-sample without a voice singing ...
when i listen to it, i'm waiting for avril's voice starting to sing!

your blog is one of the best sources for information about avril, i think!
(sorry for my bad english)
FraNK    



Friday, July 25, 2008 3:11:00 PM

Hi Frank! Don't worry - you're English is great! :)

Thanks for the links to that music, and I agree it sounds a lot like something you might hear in an Avril song.

It just goes to show that different songs can sound a lot alike, even if people are writing them in different countries in different years.

That is probably one reason the Rubinoos dropped the lawsuit against Avril - it's very difficult to prove someone has stolen from an old song.

Thanks for writing! :)

~ Courtney Hart    



Wednesday, August 27, 2008 11:35:00 AM

This argument is over a year old, but I would like to point out that it is ridiculous for you to believe that Avril couldn't have heard that song before, just because you and your family have never heard of the Rubinoos. The Rubinoos are very popular and known in the power pop music scene, a scene that Avril obviously knows much about, seeing as her music also dips into the genre of power pop. I am only twenty, and I know who the Rubinoos are. It's called having a broad taste in music. Just because they weren't as famous as other pop musicians doesn't mean that people haven't heard them and they're not worthy of praise or at least admission of being a listened to band. I have no doubt that the song was ripped off by Avril. And I suppose she and her lawyers have admitted wrong doing by settling the issue out of court-a smart move since she doesn't want to be proven wrong in the public.    



Wednesday, August 27, 2008 1:16:00 PM

Hi and thanks for commenting...

But I don't think it's any more ridiculous for me to think Avril had never heard that Rubinoos song before than it is for you to say you have "no doubt" that she must have!

I'm only 6 or so years younger than Avril, and live in the same area she grew up, and I never heard of them before. And my family - who have always been pretty uptodate with the top songs of the day - also never heard of them or that song.

Are you from the U.S.? Because there may be some popular groups there that don't get much attention here in Canada, just as there are some hit bands and singers here that people in the U.S. have never heard of. The Tragically Hip are one such band (who also started in this area I live in) that I've read 1/4 of Canadian homes have at least one of their albums/CDs .. but they never cracked the U.S. market hardly at all.

And either way - if you read my complete post here you'll see that
Tommy Dunbar of the Rubinoos has said:

"We are satisfied that any similarities between the two songs resulted from Avril and Luke's use of certain common and widely used lyrics.

We therefore completely exonerate Avril and Luke from any wrongdoing of any kind in connection with the claims made by us in our lawsuit."

So if one of The Rubinoos himself has said it was a complete coincidence, who are you to say he's wrong? :)

Although I was mad when I first heard this group was suing Avril over this song, I'm not saying they are not a decent musical group or that they didn't experienced some deserved fame when they were at their peak of success 30 or so years ago.

I just feel like they filed a petty lawsuit and knew (correctly, as it turned out) that Avril and her management would settle out of court to avoid bad press and because it would probably be cheaper than taking it to court.

But everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Especially me. :)

~ Courtney    



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